As for the list you gave from Steve White, I agree with all the aspects of the use of punishment. I tend to use a 60cc syringe (more on the human students than the animals) as it is a good interrupter and can be hidden from view until a quick shot is needed.

In many cases, I can use that stream of water to thwart a behavior immediately and redirect the animal into a more appropriate response.

The problem is that most people (and some trainers) do not understand the implication or differences between +/- punishment or +/- reinforcement and how to use them.

Thanks again for posting.

BTW: The comment box issue was a new plug-in incompatibility–have to find another one to use.

Thanks for the link, next time you want to add a link, please just put it in the website sig area so they link directly from there which will also help your PR on that page for the topic.

Then again, I wouldn’t hesitate to stick a horse behind an electric fence.

So it’s all relative, yes?

For the majority of animals and majority of skills we want to train, I believe most things can be taught with positive reinforcement.

That said, I don’t believe in absolutes and there is occasionally a time and place for punishment procedures.

The majority of dog owners are unskilled in their use of timing and mechanics and because of this have no business using shock collars or other such devices. I’ve heard stories of hunting dogs who were terrified of tree stumps because of poorly used or over used shock collars. More advanced trainers should have the skills necessary to train without such devices.

I think Steve White’s rules about punishment are pretty good guidelines about how and when to use punishment. (Click on Mary’s name to see it.)